Battery Charger Smoking

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adcprod
 
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Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adcprod »

I openly my noob status. At any rate, I recently bought the Adafruit Micro Lipo - USB LiIon/LiPoly charger and it worked great for your small Lipo 150mA battery. Then I did a quick web search and it appeared that P S 3 controller batteries should in spec for this charger as well. So... well... Doh! :(

I have a couple old batteries from broken controllers. I took one that had been sitting on the shelf for a year. (I would have assumed it to be completely flat at this point.) As soon as I plugged it into the charger, smoke started coming out. I should also point out that, it started smoking BEFORE I put the charger into a USB port.

Just so you know, I left the charger it unjumpered at 100mA. I'm not concerned about fast charging, I just want it to charge.

I'm glad that the $6 charger started smoking and not the FLORA. Of course, a few hours before doing this yesterday I had placed a ~$100 order (#425790) and it was too late to add/change/delete anything at that point.

Maybe I was doing unsupported stuff, though I didn't think so at the time. I want to get a few more things anyway so I can work with my daughter so on the new Tiara project. Do you think you guys could at least give me a break on the shipping charge for my next order that I'd like to place ASAP?

Thanks so much!

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adafruit_support_mike
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adafruit_support_mike »

Could you post a photo of how you had the battery connected to the charger please? 800x600 images usually work best.

adcprod
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adcprod »

Here is a picture. As you can see the P S 3 batteries even use the same connector as your LiPo batteries. I have no idea what happened.

I won't try this again.

Thanks!

P.S. This image is in portrait orientation and it seems you have to scroll the pic, but it is all there.
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Smoking Charger :(
Smoking Charger :(
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adafruit_support_mike
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adafruit_support_mike »

That's what I suspected.. that battery has the same connector, but the polarity at the pins is backwards.

There's a bit of shadow in the photo, but you can just make out the polarity markings on the charger's PCB:
polarity.jpg
polarity.jpg (41.15 KiB) Viewed 1069 times
Negative (black) is on the left, positive (red) is on the right. The wires coming from the battery are arranged the opposite way.

Connected that way, having the chip blow is the best thing that could have happened. If you'd managed to pump charge into the battery backwards, things could have gotten explodey.

I'm afraid I have to call this one pilot error, but at least you're only out a $6.00 charger and not a house or a hand.

adcprod
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adcprod »

I can't argue with that. :oops:

However, I would like to see you post a warning about this with your chargers. I'm kinda new to the world of DIY electronics. That said, after years of doing stuff with R/C cars, PC assembling, etc. there always seemed to be standards. You never see polarity reversed AA batteries. Also, I've also never come across Molex connectors being opposite for Dell vs Toshiba or something like that when it comes to putting in PC components.

When I see the same kind of connector for a USB-charged LiPo with roughly the same specs and same connector, I assumed (incorrectly) that it was some kind of standard. In the case of this JST connector, I don't know who is more correct Adafruit or Sony. Add to that, you might see some more folks try this as the P S 3s get phased out. So I didn't even think for a second to check polarity first.

Also, I need to point out that I cannot even write P_S_3 correctly for search purposes on your forum as it appears to be a banned SPAM word. Anyone searching your forum with this exact question isn't going to find the answer even though it is right here.

Maybe it should even say on your charger pages that LiPo batteries bought elsewhere are not supported (no matter how silly that may sound) and to be mindful of polarity for those who do choose to tempt fate. I just want my experience here to help your company and others avoid similar and/or worse problems.

Yes, end users can be dumb, but it wouldn't hurt to warn people a bit more for things like LiPo batteries that can catch fire even when used as advertised.

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adafruit_support_bill
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adafruit_support_bill »

I don't know who is more correct Adafruit or Sony.
The cells we carry are not wired to our specifications. They are standard cells. To be honest, that is the first time I have ever seen a LiPo battery with a jst connector wired differently. Don't know if this is by design (an attempt by Sony to make it proprietary?) or if it is a manufacturing error that went undetected because the intended device has a bridge on the power input. I don't have one here to test, but it would be interesting to know all of them are wired that way.
That said, after years of doing stuff with R/C cars, PC assembling, etc. there always seemed to be standards.
Unfortunately, there are always examples of manufacturers that don't follow them. There are laptop power bricks that have reverse-wired barrel connectors (GND on the center pin). There are also servos that expect to find the signal on what is normally the V+ pin.

adcprod
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adcprod »

Unfortunately, there are always examples of manufacturers that don't follow them. There are laptop power bricks that have reverse-wired barrel connectors (GND on the center pin). There are also servos that expect to find the signal on what is normally the V+ pin.
On laptops, certainly power bricks are often different and I don't dispute that, but I wouldn't have thought of them as standard in most cases. This connector seemed more standard to me than a laptop battery. Sony may very well be doing their own thing as they're know for.
I don't have one here to test, but it would be interesting to know all of them are wired that way.
Well, I tossed the original battery in the trash out of fear. The battery in the pic is actually from another controller. I think it is safe to say that it is a trend. :!:

:arrow: Once again, I'd strongly suggest putting a warning for people to check the at polarity on the JST connector if NOT using your batteries. (Feel free to say it is unsupported to use other LiPo batteries if you wish.) If the battery I had used didn't have any juice to fry the charger before inserting it into the USB port, it could have caught fire while charging when nobody was looking (in a carpeted room no less).

Please keep in mind that many of us noobs wouldn't think to check polarity when charging a similar LiPo battery on your charger when it fits perfectly. I'm just trying to save you folks and others some pain.

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adafruit_support_bill
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adafruit_support_bill »

On laptops, certainly power bricks are often different and I don't dispute that, but I wouldn't have thought of them as standard in most cases. This connector seemed more standard to me than a laptop battery.
Barrel connectors polarity is definitely more of a standard than JST connectors. They are designed specifically for power connections and the ground (outer barrel) makes contact before the center pin. 2-pin JST connectors like these are used for all sorts of power and non-power connections.

The LiPo battery industry has a convention for using these connectors for batteries. I did a little checking around and it looks like the Sony batteries are indeed wired opposite of the norm. (Standards are good. Every company should have one of their own :wink: ) I suppose since they were intended to be non-replaceable, they didn't think they needed to follow any standard. At least they had the good sense to stick with the standard red/black wire color conventions.

I'll look into adding warnings for these. But basic precautions should always be followed when connecting a power source of uncertain origin. If you contact [email protected] with a link to this thread we'll add a Blue SmokeMonster badge to your next order.

adafruit
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adafruit »

The product text now says "For use with Adafruit Lipoly batteries only! Other batteries may have different voltage, chemistry, polarity or pinout. "

adcprod
 
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Re: Battery Charger Smoking

Post by adcprod »

Thanks!

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