Home Automation

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Home Automation

Postby bobfixesstuff » Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:39 am

anyone know much about home automation? specifically via IP.

I've taken a look around and discovered a few products that have built in web servers, so via one's home broadband one can broadcast a secure/semi-secure (often smartphone friendly) site with buttons to switch mains relays.

for things like turning lights on and off, starting or stopping central heating etc.

anyone discovered anything like a PCI card or USB adapted gadget with a relay control board?

anyone heard of something like a program that provides a web server and controls a serial or usb device?

actually, I've discovered IP cameras like this

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wireless-camera ... 530&sr=8-1

which connect directly to a modem (cat5), and rout their control via the website of the company which makes the cameras.

smartphone users can then pan, tilt, rotate the camera. so in a device such as that we have controls ready built in to operate two servos in either direction. that could easilly be adapted to control four mains relays for home automation. plus one would get a camera feed, (although hijacking the servos would make the camera perspective static).

any thoughts? :D
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Re: Home Automation

Postby bobfixesstuff » Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:48 am

these IP cameras also often feature sound.

meaning you can shout through them at a burglar, and listen in as well as see.

anyone come across a sound activated relay controller? I've come across pitch and decibel activated controllers, but what about something a little more digital? like something that interprets morse code? or just a bleep counter?

I remember my father bought a fax / answering machine about 15 years ago that would respond to DTMF tones though the phoneline, and then play recorded messages down the line to the user who is somewhere else on the planet. bit beyond me to design a circuit incorporating stuff of that sophistication though!
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Re: Home Automation

Postby franklin97355 » Mon Aug 22, 2011 8:26 pm

All of the things you mention exist and there are plenty of links on Google to them. There are also links to home automation.
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Re: Home Automation

Postby buzzdavidson » Wed Aug 24, 2011 1:55 am

franklin97355 wrote:All of the things you mention exist and there are plenty of links on Google to them. There are also links to home automation.


Yes, and frankly, 98% of them suck (and the other 2% are barely tolerable). The commercial solutions are overpriced and expensive, and the FOSS solutions are either so hopelessly mired in legacy cruft (Misterhouse) or too "bleeding edge" for day-to-day use. I've spent a ridiculous amount of time over the last two years experimenting in this arena, and have spent way more money than I care to admit trying out different technologies and solutions (seriously. You don't want to know how much...). This frustration is what drove me into the warm embrace of Arduino <g>

Some high points from my digging, however:

* The X10-based motion detectors are cheap and extremely reliable; combined with the WGL W800 wireless receiver, you can put together a very usable occupancy/motion monitoring system. Forget anything else X10, it's all banned. And for goodness sake don't buy anything direct from the X10 site or they will spam you within an inch of your life.
* Z-Wave is an excellent technology for lighting, power monitoring, HVAC control, etc. The OpenZWave project has made integration with these technologies very straightforward, and the technology has the backing of several big-name manufacturers (Leviton, etc.) This is a perfect application of wireless mesh networking; the more devices you have installed, the more reliable the network becomes.
* Don't be drawn into Insteon. The devices are pretty and it works well enough, but it is a proprietary solution that is still bogged down by X10 legacy. My house is about 50% Z-Wave and 50% Insteon, mostly because I found Insteon first. I'll be replacing the devices with Z-Wave as they die off.
* UPB? forget it. Ridiculously expensive, and like wired Insteon and X10 before it STILL subject to line noise, slow transmission speeds, and quirky behavior. Don't believe vendor assurances to the contrary.
* Pachube rocks, and thingspeak isn't far behind. Gather data locally and push it out to the cloud; let them perform backups, administration, system patches, security updates, firewalling, access control, etc. Unless you like that sort of thing.
* XBee and Digi ConnectPort are very, very handy technologies. Pick up a copy of Rob Faludi's "building wireless sensor networks" for practical examples and ideas. This book caused me to re-think my whole approach to data acquisition, monitoring, and integration.
* Forget 1-Wire. It's a dead technology. (See previous point). The current fascination with temperature sensing with single DS18B20s is perplexing to me, as there are other cheaper, less complex solutions on the market for this use case. 1-Wire is a neat networking topology, and shines with lots of devices sharing a single bus. One sensor? forget it.
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Re: Home Automation

Postby henk » Wed Aug 24, 2011 5:08 pm

* Z-Wave is an excellent technology for lighting, power monitoring, HVAC control, etc. The OpenZWave project has made integration with these technologies very straightforward, and the technology has the backing of several big-name manufacturers (Leviton, etc.) This is a perfect application of wireless mesh networking; the more devices you have installed, the more reliable the network becomes.


What equipment/manufacturer are you using? And from whom did you purchase it?
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Re: Home Automation

Postby buzzdavidson » Thu Aug 25, 2011 9:11 pm

The stuff from Leviton is rock-solid but expensive. I'm fond of the Leviton-VRI06-1LZ switches. Price from online retailers varies wildly, I purchased a bunch of them from smarthome.com during a crazy sale for $40 each. I've seen them priced up to $150 for a single switch (!), which is utterly ridiculous. These work really well with the Philips A19 LED bulbs (with the odd yellow filter). I use the HomeSeer Z-Troller as a PC interface, it just works.

I know several people who are fond of their Cooper Devices switches, but they are wickedly expensive. Very solid, quiet, and responsive, but IMHO no more so than their Leviton equivalents.

In general I've found the GE Z-Wave products to be severely lacking; cheap looking, cheap feeling, and buggy.

Products from Aeon Labs are also quite nice - their SmartSwitch allows you to both remotely control a load as well as monitor power consumption. Think of it as a commercial tweet-a-watt with built in relay.

Aeon labs announced several cool new products at CES this last year, including modules that you can install directly in your switch boxes in parallel with your existing power switches to add monitoring and remote control. They are already available in Europe but have not yet been released in the US.

Since this is still a niche market, the products are all reasonably expensive. In general, I've found that the more expensive switches are quieter to activate (if not downright silent), smoother dimming, more responsive, and support more features than their cheaper brethren.

As I said in my prior post, avoid the urge to buy any of the motion sensor or other security products (door/window sensors, etc); they are savagely over-priced and extremely limiting in implementation. The need for a reasonably-priced room occupancy sensor is what got me into Arduino to begin with.
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Re: Home Automation

Postby bobfixesstuff » Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:29 pm

i discovered this...

http://denkovi.com/category/16/all-products.html

Denkovi, small company in Bulgaria.

Ethernet controlled relay boards. With built in web servers I believe, so from a remote internet connected terminal (smartphone I hope but don't own any equipment yet so can't tell) one can switch relays.

Some of their boards also accept and report analogue and digital inputs too I think?

Someone with a better mind than mine might want to take a look and report back.

Either way, this looks like pretty neat stuff! Looks highly adaptable!

I bought a FOSCAM IP camera. Works okay.... few trivial complaints but in general; yes, with a smartphone and an app and either WIFI or a decent 3G connection to the web from the phone, you CAN see inside your house in realtime, with decent resolution, camera control etc. If you want to see inside a remote location, these IP cameras CAN get the job done nicely. Oh and they can also motion detect and email you. FOSCAM is just a brand name for the dozens of made in china IP cameras available. Most are unbranded.

Do check out that Denkovi IP relay board everyone! It looks exciting, and looks like it will be more exciting when people cleverer than I figure out what it is capable of!
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Re: Home Automation

Postby buzzdavidson » Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:27 pm

CAI makes a nice little board as well:

http://goo.gl/nJqp2
http://goo.gl/7p3kd
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Re: Home Automation

Postby bobfixesstuff » Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:28 pm

ooooh sweet find buzzdavidson!

much cheaper than the denkovi thing.... I can't visually see relays on the board though... ah on amazon it says:

The eight TTL output is by default at logic zero. When an output is triggered or turned on, it sends out 5V, maximum drive current 20MA. It is capable to drive an optical isolated SSR (Solid State Relay, normal input control voltage 3-32V current is < 10mA) device to run a motor, siren, light, heater or refrigerator.

amazon also says £40 though... but then adding relays might be costly.

still though it also will email you and reviews say the programming is really easy.

"The most powerful feature of this device is its programmable output control. You dont need ladder diagram or programming it through any other software like other industrial PLC."

nice find!
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Re: Home Automation

Postby buzzdavidson » Thu Sep 08, 2011 1:06 am

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Re: Home Automation

Postby chrisjx » Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:34 pm

Some high points from my digging


Great summary, BuzzDavidson.

I share your perspective about products being quirky and too expensive. I've built my platform based on xbee radios hooked up to sensors (only use arduino when the sensor is complex and needs up front processing). I used MightyOhm's approach to flash an Asus Wifi router ($35) with OpenWRT, added python as the scripting language, soldered an xbee radio to a serial port on the motherboard as the central receiver, then wrote scripts to send the data to http://Pachube.com, http://ThingSpeak.com, or http://Open.Sen.se. I hooked up multiple Tweet-a-watt devices for power tracking, and designed a generic xbee PCB with place-holders for up to 4 sensors (temp, light, gas, fsr, hall effect, etc.) I found Rob Faludi's book to be very helpful with the xbee info. I have played with Digi's X2 and a Smart Plug but it was more to learn how they work because they're a bit too expensive for me.

I have not explored Z-Wave and am a little reticent to add yet another protocol to my mix. Based on your experience, what do you see as a reasonable comparison to xbee; and can they be used "together" (I know the protocols are different; but within the same ecosystem)?

There was a gateway device that someone had proposed on KickStarter that promised to have a plug and play approach to providing access to zigbee, z-wave, wifi, etc., but I can't find it today. Perhaps it failed. ;(

Anyway, thanks for your insights.
fun with Wireless Sensor Networks...
Gateway: Raspberry Pi (formerly wifi routers with OpenWRT), Python -> Cosm.com, ThingSpeak.com, Open.Sen.se, etc.
Hardware: Tweet-A-Watt, (+ temp, ldr/light, gas, fsr, etc.)
My notes at: http://TinajaLabs.com
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Re: Home Automation

Postby jkCBWPnet » Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:11 pm

this arduino device has a webserver built in:
http://www.adafruit.com/products/418

there are tutorials on this site (here)
and all over you can easily have sensors connected and outputs (servos, relays whatever)

chrisjx mentioned the arduino and also using xbee (there is a lot of support for it) if you wanted wireless sensors etc (wired is cheapest) what specifically would you like to control? multi zone heating/cooling? alarm, lights etc? the arduino platform can do it all only limitation seems to be speed and memory (everything is expandable ;) )

the same things could get applied to the chumby which is a mini linux box and can be found here.
http://jk.cbwp.net
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Re: Home Automation

Postby buzzdavidson » Fri Sep 09, 2011 2:17 pm

@chrisjx: Looks like we've ended up with very similar solutions. XBee and ZWave seem to co-exist just fine in my house, though to be fair I haven't looked too closely at the stats to check for collisions, etc.

If I were starting from scratch with a new project knowing what I've learned over the last year, I'd go with a simple RF-based sensor network combined with Z-Wave for light control. I've got a little industrial uATX machine running Debian that coordinates everything; core scripting is all Python for portability.

The jury is still out regarding which specific RF technology I'd use; XBee S2 is very nice and the mesh protocol is quite well thought out, but the devices are quite a bit more expensive than the alternatives. I've got a bunch of other RF devices that I'm playing with at present (nordic RF as well as several solutions from TI and other vendors).

Though direct AC control isn't all that difficult, I am not likely to install any device that's not UL or CE qualified in a wall outlet. Therefore, I'd probably stick with the commercial offerings in this realm; probably Z-Wave as it's easy to integrate with and quite full featured. DMX looks neat too :)
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Re: Home Automation

Postby meseta » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:55 am

Hey all, some really interesting things in this thread. I was wondering if you guys know from experience the cost of home automated systems that you could buy/make? Particularly XBee vs WiFi vs commercial solution for example.

Are we talking $50 per automation unit, or is it more like $150?
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Re: Home Automation

Postby jkCBWPnet » Sat Sep 10, 2011 7:22 pm

@meseta
the cheapest using wireless?
cheapest single controller or complete home...
if i was looking up something for you to make or buy, I would want to know what you want it to do first and any criteria that may be concerned (stuff that must be considered like I live in a metal barn ;) )

@bob honestly one of my first home automation purchases was a long time ago from x10.com and i bought a kit ($ ? 50 bucks maybe) I dont remember if it was the active home or something else but i have a serial device called the firecracker it is model CM17A and it is a wireless device that communicates to your x10 stuff and I have personally used [someone elses] code, for my arduino to talk through it.

just to put that out there as buzz mentioned x10.
@buzz by the way what did u use as the actual sensor for your room occupancy? beam break?
http://jk.cbwp.net
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