Reflow oven T100C

[bandtank]

Haha it's no problem. I just wanted to be sure before I submitted an order for the T200C+. I've thought about getting nitrogen but I guess I don't really have a need for it. Also, I can't find any objective reviews of the T200C vs T200C+.

This is the reply I got from Wendy at Torch regarding the differences:

Hello Anthony,
Yes, there are reflow oven T200C+ and T200N+.
The difference between T200C and T200C+ is the temperature measurement function. T200C+ has this function, T200C has no that.
The difference between T200N and T200N+ is the temperature measurement function. T200N+ has this function, T200N has no that.

please see quotation:
T200C+ USD2338 FOB Beijing

T200N+ USD3076 FOB Beijing

So the + versions have closed loop control of the temperature, but I would really like to see something more tangible in terms of a performance comparison. The datasheet is pretty generic also:

T200C+ Unique Features
With all advantage of T200C
With better airproof function, the temperature is more uniformity.
With emitting smoke function.
With purifying and filtering exhaust gas function.
With single channel temperature measurement (multi channels is optical), T200C+ has been the first-class reflow oven.

I am also rather curious about the software. Does it work well? The datasheet screenshots make it seem like one of two things: ugly GUI with good functionality and it does what it says it does, or ugly GUI and it sucks overall.

Sorry for asking so many questions and thank you for answering them. I haven't been able to find this information anywhere on the internet. If I end up getting one I'm going to make a page specifically detailing every little thing about it as I'm sure someone else out there is wondering the same things.

[gsattler]

bandtank, I spoke with my reflow oven operator and the engineer who setup the oven and they both mentioned that there is a 5-6°C consistent and repeatable error that you need to calibrate out by shifting the temperature profile to get the correct air temperature at the board. In my conversations with PCB/Stencils Unlimited they mentioned that this small variance agrees with what they have seen. You have to measure the air temperature with a reliable and calibrated thermometer to get good results with nearly any oven. The engineer who setup the reflow oven said that while the GUI is horrible, all the features work as advertised. Here are the configuration files and lead free solder profiles that we use.

[bandtank]

Thanks for the files and advice. I think I'm going to go with the T200C+ as it isn't much more expense to make it closed loop. Hopefully it's worth it. I'll post when I get it and have had a chance to mess around with it.

[blogger]

Thanks for the reflow profile.
I will test this today or tomorrow on my T200N.

[gsattler]

Bandtank and blogger, any luck with the oven profile?

[blogger]

Hey, ya sorry.
This forum likes to expire my login every time and it takes forever to lookup the password.
You know what, I never noticed there was a "send to oven" button (my interface is in chinese).
So my oven was actually running on whatever default profile came loaded in it even though I've adjusted the table on the left to match the printouts in the manual I got with it. So when I got your profile, I entered it in, then noticed this "send" button. It takes like 30 seconds to upload profile to the oven, and now I'm using it. Works good, though it takes longer than the default profile.

Any idea how to change the buzzer beep time? With your profile now it beeps like 1 minute in, which isn't even during reflow phase. Ideally I'd like it to beep almost near the end so I know its time to turn off nitrogen.

[bandtank]

I haven't bought the oven yet because I am concerned about the quality. Maybe I'm just being paranoid, but I tend to have bad experiences buying practically anything from China. I am mostly concerned about how to get spare parts if it breaks. If there is a way for me to get parts I would be less worried about it.

[gsattler]

We haven't had a need to buy any parts for the oven yet. If you are concerned about parts availability maybe buying the used APS Novastar batch reflow oven on eBay would be a good idea. APS Novastar is located here in the states and the guy we buy stencils from specifically had good stuff to say about the the small APS GoldFlows. For reference he also likes the Torch ovens as well.

[bandtank]

We haven't had a need to buy any parts for the oven yet. If you are concerned about parts availability maybe buying the used APS Novastar batch reflow oven on eBay would be a good idea. APS Novastar is located here in the states and the guy we buy stencils from specifically had good stuff to say about the the small APS GoldFlows. For reference he also likes the Torch ovens as well.

The APS ovens are pretty expensive. The Torch, if it works well, is the sweet spot for this type of oven I think. I may go ahead and order, but I have one final question. Is the software in Chinese or can you get it in English? Is there a way to download it ahead of time as a demo?

[gsattler]

The software is written in English, but you will have to be somewhat creative with some of the translations. For what its worth, the APS batch reflow oven on eBay is Buy It Now for $3100, maybe make a lower offer and they'll take it since its one of those 25 day listings. I'm not selling it, it just might be worth checking out.

[bandtank]

The software is written in English, but you will have to be somewhat creative with some of the translations. For what its worth, the APS batch reflow oven on eBay is Buy It Now for $3100, maybe make a lower offer and they'll take it since its one of those 25 day listings. I'm not selling it, it just might be worth checking out.

That oven has been on ebay for months. It was manufactured in the 90s. I called APS and had one of their sales reps look at the auction listing and he pointed out several ways to know it was a pretty old model. The T200C/+ is a much better oven than that particular model.

[bandtank]

The software is written in English, but you will have to be somewhat creative with some of the translations. For what its worth, the APS batch reflow oven on eBay is Buy It Now for $3100, maybe make a lower offer and they'll take it since its one of those 25 day listings. I'm not selling it, it just might be worth checking out.

Also, I wanted to say thanks again for being so helpful. I really appreciate people like you who are willing to offer advice and experiences on forums. I think I'm going to go with the T200C+ based on your recommendations and opinions.

[bandtank]

I bought a T200C from Manncorp this morning. Their version of the T200C has the closed loop temperature controller and various other small improvements that hopefully make it worth the little bit of extra money. I will post about it when it arrives.

[bandtank]

It's pretty good. The software is complete banned, though. I mean a real, honest to god, piece of banned. I am actually going to rewrite the application as soon as I get some free time. The microcontroller running the oven controls it mostly okay, but I think I am going to redesign that as well. If you are low volume then this will work fine, but if you need something higher quality then spend 2x as much as you will be happy you did. It works, but the software is so atrocious it is ridiculous.

[blogger]

furiously waiting for software that isn't trash.
maybe someone can rewrite the software for MDC picknplace too.