I am writing to correct what are arguably misrepresentations of my
position and to answer adafruit's message. But first some
Phil (or whoever writes as "adafruit") has so far shown no interest in
debating the merits of the statements made from that account
regarding Cy and TT which I argue are unreasonable and at times
slanderous. (Please see the 18854 thread for details).
Nor has adafruit offered to, or discussed the merits of, archiving and
removing the "BUYER BEWARE" thread 15930 which is so prominent
Cy has apologised and fixed some problems with his eBay ads.
Adafruit insists he writes an apology on their forums and that the
fake domain be transferred. I agree the fake domain should be
transferred by whoever controls it, but I think its rather fussy to be
demanding exactly what forum and form the apology is delivered in -
especially while stonewalling on the examination of the matters
mentioned above which are of most concern to Cy / TT.
Phil (I assume), you wrote, in part:
>> Robin-Whittle wrote:Because of the avoidance and suppression of
>> discussion (2 threads closed in short order), after Cy pointed
>> me to his two eBay pages with his apology, I decided not to
>> mention it on a forum thread.
> hi robin,
> that is not correct. this thread as well as the "Technology
> Transplant / Chahae Yasaena "chipforbrains" threatens & extorts
> adafruit" are open. viewtopic.php?f=7&t=18854
I found the two threads I wrote in regarding TT were closed rapidly.
In the absence of any other communications, I figured it best to
communicate with you and some of the other folks via the private
message system, since I only had email addresses for one or two of
> the x0xb0x moderator phono locked the thread "Disappointed with
> Devil Fish attitude!" - we did not, but will open it if you would
> like. viewtopic.php?f=7&t=18977
If you like. I have written plenty and don't intend to write to that
>> But my account had been altered so I could neither read nor
>> send private messages. More such messages arrived while I was
>> sleeping. Now I can read the messages and the first one is from
>> adafruit, telling me I can use the forums but not to use the
>> private message system for this TT matter.
> that's correct you have a newly made account and you sent too
> many private messages in one hour. if you spam people the forum
> system can disable your ability to send private messages, as you
> noted you can read private messages. please do not spam members
> using the board's private message system. if you do this again your
> account may get suspended, if that happens please email us - but
> again, do not use the private message features to spam multiple
My messages were pertinent and directed to people I had already
been discussing the same matter with on a forum thread. I think
you are mistaken to describe my use of your private message
system as "spamming". The system still has "You are not authorised
to send private messages." That's fine, since I don't intend to.
> you also know our email address and phone number.
I don't know your or Limor's email address. There's no email
addresses on the contact page, and though I guess I could search the
Web for addresses, that doesn't mean you want me to contact you on
any such addresses I find. I have never received an email from you
or Limor but would be happy to discuss things privately with you via
email. Since you both seem to resistant to examining your own
actions and how they affect Cy / TT, I don't feel particularly like
talking to you about this by phone.
I got involved in this because I wanted to get the fake site removed
ASAP. Whether it was made by Cy or not, it was a stupid,
destructive, hateful and time-wasting thing which needed to be
knocked on the head ASAP. I knew there would be many people
clamouring for this to be done, but I figured that by writing to Cy and
posting the message verbatim on the 15930 thread, I might be able
to accelerate the site's demise.
I then discovered some sense of the depth of the bad blood between
Cy / TT and adafruit, and the problem with his eBay page attribution,
thanks to Altitude describing this clearly on the Analogue Heaven
mailing list. So I mentioned the attribution problem to Cy.
Then I tried to convince you to consider the impact of the 15930
thread and your statements therein.
> I have never and you can post here or create a new topic at
> any time. we respect your work and think you're doing your best
> to help your business,
Thanks. I am also trying to enhance your ability to do business - and
> we think you may be confused by cy and TT which is understandable.
Maybe Cy did make the fake site. I can't prove otherwise.
He has made changes and apologised.
You have been fussy about the form of his apology - and you have
failed to discuss my constructive critique about some of your
statements about Cy / TT. These concerns are shared by some other
people with a long history in this forum.
>> I can't prove anything absolutely, but I am sure it is not Cy
>> who made the fake site and extortion letter. He has consistently
>> stated it was a "friend" who did it, who he later identified as -
>> "Mr He".
Actually, I am not 100% sure.
The fake site caused no damage to Adafruit Industry's reputation and
little or no confusion to your customers. It caused a great deal of
damage to the reputation of Cy and Technology Transplant.
The fake site is a separate issue from the topic of thread 15930,
and your avoidance of discussing that thread looms large above this
What's your problem in discussing statements made in the past? Do
you never make mistakes? Is adafruit some hyper-intelligent entity
whose output functions always exactly match the asymptote of
perfection? Do you never overshoot the mark? Do you never utter a
word that, at the time or later, turns out to have been sub-optimal?
Does your backspace key sit there forlornly, year-after-year, unused
and gathering dust?
Accolades and awards are entirely due to you because you do Good
Work. But is there some rule of the cosmos which means re-
examination of your past actions is such a pointless exercise that
there's no need to mention why you don't do it?
I believe your statement about Cy / TT:
** it appears he has only done harmful things to the community
** and customers.
is slanderous. It appears in viewtopic.php?f=29&t=15930
which is currently (for me at least) the first non TT website result
when Googling for "Technology Transplant".
I understand you want control of the fake domain and I agree you
should have it. You stated that there were other fake domains, but
haven't given details. Email them to me if you like and if they exist
I will confirm that this is so on the forum, without divulging the
Must Cy admit every fault you allege he has, on your very own forum,
to your satisfaction, before you will examine your potential mistakes?
> a "friend" using the same IP address and email addresses as cy?
The IP addresses I saw in his emails were scattered amongst a range
and none had the address you quoted.
If Cy really did make the fake site and demand money from you, why
(once the site's files have been deleted) is this an impediment to
examining your own slanderous and unreasonable public statements
> robin, you required us to "prove" cy emailed us and many other
> things. all to your satisfaction,
Maybe he sent it, maybe it was a friend. I can't tell.
> if you want anyone to believe cy has nothing to do with this
> despite the same IP addresses, emails, information from *directly
> from his ISP / hosting provider* and more - you'll need provide
> something more than saying "you are sure".
I am not 100% sure.
Do you need complete and utter capitulation on your terms before
you reconsider how fair some of your own past statements are?
> regardless, if you want to continue to believe this and say this -
> then you need to have cy who you are in constant contact with work
> with "his friend" to resolve this and transfer the domain names.
I have repeatedly urged him to ask his friend to pass control of the
domain to you.
> customers have emailed us and have shown us packages from "cy"
> that say "mr. he". keep in mind the fake adafruit site only had
> emails we sent to cy posted on the them, it's unlikely "his friend"
> would have all of cy's emails, all addressed to cy, all from a year
Sure, you can go on and on about the evils of Cy and use this as a
smokescreen to avoid examining your own mistakes. When people
who you perceive as your friends, or who you don't, but who
nonetheless support you, as I do, tell you there are some mistakes
which should be examined . . . . .
>> I am not sure that Cy can access the forum site anyway - he
>> indicated it was blocked by the Chinese government filter.
> also not correct, cy can post here any time. we work with
> many people in china, including the same district as cy - they
> even have the same IP blocks. our site is not blocked by any
> chinese government filter.
OK - but maybe Cy is so pissed at you guys for various reasons that
he doesn't want to post to your forum, or write to you. I can't do
anything about this, and maybe his experience of you is that you are
impossible to get along with. Maybe he doesn't want to post to a
forum where you are in control, closing threads as you wish. I figure
you or I would be reticent about debating things on a forum
conducted in Cantonese or Mandarin.
> cy can also email us and cc you if you'd like.
I urged him to write to you.
>> Adafruit stated that the fake site was on the same IP address
>> as the TT site, but this is not the case and was not the case
>> when I first saw the fake site.
> it's the same hosting provider, on the same servers, same DNS,
> a forum member contacted cy / TT through the fake site and TT
> answered. the ISP said the site is owned by TT. you can review
> all of this in the forums. the ISP had cy's name / contact on
> an old support ticket requested the adafruit site "clone".
Sure, but you avoid admitting you were wrong to state
) that the sites were
on the same address:
~~ the "fake" adafruit site is hosted on the same server as
~~ technology transplant,
> cy works with TT, sends emails as TT, runs auctions as TT. cy's
> previous email address we have was used for the contact information
> the domain name (and the ISP also has this information).
Maybe so. Maybe Cy registered the fake domain, made the
offensive site and mailed you an extortion letter. He has since
apologised and made significant changes.
If the fake site was his, then when it comes to the all-important
matter of public perceptions (reputation) he shot himself in the foot.
Its been a time-waster for Adafruit Industries, but it hasn't harmed
you or your reputation. Do you want to go on and on about how
much his actions harmed and threatened you when the site's
offensive and misleading contents were quickly deleted?
> perhaps you should ask cy to tell his "friend" to apologize and
> transfer the domain names? wouldn't cy be motivated to do this,
> why would cy continue to work with people that are harming him?
I have done this repeatedly and you are misrepresenting my position
to write as if I have not.
> robin, you're being manipulated by cy to be convinced a "friend"
> did this. this is what children do when they are caught doing
> something. a "friend" did it.
Maybe so. Maybe Cy has bats in his belfry and friends in his head.
He and his TT colleagues also do Good Work. They do essential,
unique, valuable work - with great investments and risk. As far as I
know, they can't make a lot of money from it all. Their eBay
feedback is good and they do lots of things far beyond x0xb0xes.
He or his friend shot themselves in the foot and were a PITA for you,
threatening you with ongoing fake site harassment etc. That lasted
about two days, I think.
Previously, I understand they were a PITA for you regarding the
burden of supporting people building kits - but I understand other
people sold kits too. Surely most people building these kits for the
first time need a lot of support.
Is there some kind of generally unmentioned source of tension
between Adafruit and TT? I could imagine Cy being in a very good
position to find and purchase obscure dual transistors and other
obsolete TB-303 parts, to the point of there being too few available
for Adafruit to continue making x0xb0x kits.
He has is complaints against you and you against him. You are
widely respected and have a prominent forum, which you at times
use in ways which damage his reputation. AFAIK, he doesn't write
about Adafruit Industries in any public forum, or even in private
messages - at least to me. I had no idea there was a dispute
between him and you. By accident and/or design, his eBay pages
were disrespectful and inadequate regarding Adafruit, but I think that
is in the past.
Cy has made changes and apologised for his or his friends mistakes.
- Robin http://www.firstpr.com.au/rwi/dfish/