Ice Tube Clock Problem.

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Hreagle
 
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Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by Hreagle »

Screen 2
Screen 2
Pic2.jpg (836.99 KiB) Viewed 1317 times
Screen 1
Screen 1
Pic1.jpg (837.05 KiB) Viewed 1317 times
I just completed building my Ice Tube clock and I'm having a problem with it. Trying to set it up I cannot get into the settings except for at first I was able to get the display bright enough to see. All I seem to be able to get it to do is flash between the Pic1 screen and Pic2 screen. I believe I am following the setup instructions properly but I'm really getting frustrated. Also the last digit on the right is less bright than the left hand side ones. Can anyone help me with this? Thanks.

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adafruit_support_bill
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by adafruit_support_bill »

We don't see many IceTubes these days. We had to discontinue them some time ago since the tubes are getting too scarce.

Let's start with some clear photos of the fronts and backs of both boards.

Are you running with the stock firmware, or one of JArchie's custom versions?

The dimmer digits toward the end of the tube is a known issue. There are some remedies for that discussed in the forums.

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jarchie
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by jarchie »

This does look like my firmware by the picture. "pwr rset" just means that the most recent reset was caused by restoration of power; any reset ("rset") message will go away after setting the time. As with the Adafruit firmware, flashing indicates that the time has not been set.

If the build is good, the usage instructions for xmas is available on GitHub. Note that by default xmas uses a slightly different button scheme than the default Adafruit firmware, but the menu structure for setting the time is the same. (The button scheme is specified in firmware/config.h at compile time.)

Do you hear an audible tick when hitting each button? If not, I would suggest checking the soldering of the microcontroller and buttons themselves. Then checking to ensure each button has continuity when pressed and no continuity when not pressed.

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Hreagle
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by Hreagle »

Thanks for the replies. I did manage to straighten things out by reading other post's. I didn't quite understand how to use the buttons until reading another explanation from a post and I resolved the digit brightness issue by jumpering out the filament resistor and replacing the Transistor with the newer version. the clock loses a couple seconds an hour right now and I'm going to flash the Xmas firmware into it and add a GPS to the unit. I have a programmer and GPS Module now and I just have to learn how to use it and download the new file. I'll post how it turns out when I'm done.
Warren

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jarchie
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by jarchie »

Wow. You're making great progress! Congrats on your success with buttons and fixing the dim digit issue.

Swapping out the transistor, as you did, is the best solution to the dim digit issue. The xmas firmware does have an option to individually adjust digit brightness via software, but it's probably better for tube life to drive it with sufficient current.

A normal clock drift is on the order of a couple seconds per day--not per hour. You might try cleaning the board with flux cleaner (or alcohol) and a toothbrush, as any extra capacitance from a dirty board might cause the clock to run slow. Otherwise the GPS upgrade you suggest will definitely fix the problem.

Good luck and happy hacking!

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Hreagle
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by Hreagle »

Thanks for the reply, I thought the time error was excessive but I always clean my boards with IPA and brushes so the board is spotless. I'm using a Nixie clock with a WiFi time server connection as my reference so I'm sure the time there is accurate. Does anyone know if I can just purchase a new chip already flashed with the Xmas program in it?
With the addition of the new Transistor and upping the power to the heater the display now looks pretty good but the first digit is just slightly dimmer than the rest of them. Not enough to really matter but if I could tweak it just a bit brighter with the new software it would look perfect.

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jarchie
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by jarchie »

It looks like you already have the xmas firmware installed; xmas is the only firmware that lists the cause of each chip reset (e.g. "pwr rset"). So you can probably already use the per-digit brightness controls in the menus under "cfg disp"/"digit bri" ("configure display"/"digit brightness"). See the firmware/USAGE file for more information.

There was once a seller on eBay that offered clones of the Adafruit kit with the xmas firmware pre-installed... Is it possible that is where you purchased your kit? (This seller has no relationship to me or--to my knowledge--Adafruit.)

As you noted, time drift of two seconds per hour is pretty extreme--about 550 ppm. The software automatic drift correction within xmas (by default) only works for up to about 150 ppm, so that unfortunately will not help in your case. For reference, a typical clock crystal is rated for +/- 20 ppm accuracy. The time loss in your clock could point to a problem with the oscillator circuit. There's some more information on oscillator issues in the firmware/REAMDE file under the troubleshooting section.

I'm not really setup to program chips at the moment, and I don't know of a good source for this--at least not for xmas. The xmas firmware is targeted toward clock hackers and modders. The trade-off for being compatible with so many hardware configurations was that most hardware-specific options are specified at firmware compile time. So if you're modding the hardware of your clock, it's better to compile and install the firmware yourself so you can get all the customizable options to suit your particular clock.

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Hreagle
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by Hreagle »

Hello Jarchie, I did buy my clock kit on Ebay and you are right, this is not your clock it was built by a guy called Dr. Aiden Fang and his web site is not Adafruit it is Omnixie.com or retio.co. and he even linked me to your Lady Ada assembly instructions! There were a few different parts on this board from your kit. Two caps c8 & c9 are 10pf rather than 20pf the .1uf 100v cap looks different than the one in your instructions, it has the Atmega 328PU processor. I noticed that the brightness setting did have the 2 settings like you mentioned in your post but I only used the one to brighten the digits globally. I'll have to go back and see how the other setting works. Reading a message I got back from this guy the clock does have the Xmas program running in it. That is why I initially had setup problems until I went to Github and used those instructions. Could the different cap values be why my timing is so far off? I'll have to go back to Github and read further, maybe I'm already able to use my GPS for the time. I can't believe this Snake has pirated your design! Thank you for setting me straight.
Regards,
Warren

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jarchie
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by jarchie »

I'm just one of the many Ice Tube Clock hackers out there, but have no relationship to Adafruit. I did write the xmas alternative firmware back in the day, so I guess you could say that I have some familiarity with it. ;-)

You can tell if your version of xmas has GPS support compiled in by toggling through the menus. In the menus, select "cfg regn", and go through the list of submenus. If you see "set zone," then your version of xmas includes support for the GPS mod. Unfortunately, there is no way to see the baud rate for communication. The default in xmas is 9600 which works with the Adafruit Ultimate GPS module, but you'd have to ask whoever provided your kit if they left the default in place or changed the baudrate to another speed.

Xmas only runs on the atmega328p chip. It's too large to fit on the 168v and also uses the picoPower features of the 328p for extra sleep efficiency. So that's why you have a different chip.

With respect to the clock circuit, the Adafruit design would often lose about 2-3 seconds per day with the default 20 pF caps--at least in my experience. Reducing the capacitors to 10 pF increased accuracy on the few clocks where I tried that. But with a clock drift of 2 seconds per hour, you might have a slightly damaged crystal. Here's an excerpt from the xmas firmware/REAMDE troubleshooting section:
Finally, replacing the crystal will sometimes resolve the issue. The
replacement should be another 32.768 kHz crystal with a 12.5 pF load
capacitance and equivalent series resistance of 30 kOhm or less. The
AB38T-32.768KHZ is a good choice and is available from Digi-Key or
Mouser. When installing and soldering the crystal, gently push the
crystal through the circuit board until there is 2-3 mm of space
between the bottom of the crystal and the circuit board. Leaving this
space prevents undue stress on the leads which could damage the
crystal; it also ensures solder will not make unwanted electrical
contact with the metallic crystal housing.

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jarchie
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by jarchie »

Also your kit isn't pirated. Adafruit no longer makes their kit anymore and allows other people to copy and modify their design. Like the kit, xmas is also free for anyone to download, use, and modify. So your kit supplier has done nothing wrong. It's all good.

I was just pointing out why your kit is different, and why I don't quite know what you have in your hands.

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Hreagle
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by Hreagle »

Hello again jarchie, Thanks for the info. I have a lot of respect for guys like you who can create programs. I have never been much good programming except for a small amount of Basic back in the old days.
The timing on my clock is terrible and I may have done some damage to the Crystal by pushing it down too close to the board. I didn't realize how fragile they were. Most of the stuff I have built used real time clock modules. I'll have to purchase a new crystal, thanks for the part number. I did find these crystals on Ebay that I believe are eq. What do you think?
https://www.raltron.com/webproducts/spe ... T-5PPM.pdf

After I replace the crystal I'm going to test the accuracy and then try getting the GPS working. My software has the options you listed so maybe it will work. I'm at my winter home in Florida and will be going back up North to NY soon so it may not be until the fall when I'm back here that I finish working on it. If the crystals arrive quick enough I'll at least have time to test the accuracy.
Thanks again for the help.
Warren

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jarchie
 
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Re: Ice Tube Clock Problem.

Post by jarchie »

Thank you for the kind words with respect to coding. I am a programmer by training, so learning the hardware was the new thing for me.

The Ice Tube Clock drives the crystal directly from the microcontroller to save space on the board. This setup usually works well, but occasionally the crystal does get damaged during installation. Real time clock modules are often a touch less finicky and save the designer from having to write tricky sleep code, since the main microcontroller can simply power off and doesn't need to keep track of time.

That crystal datasheet you posted looks good as far as I can tell. It is pretty much identical to the one in the original Adafruit kit, but more accurate. I hope it helps!

If you have a "cfg regn"/"set zone", then my guess is that your kit comes with the default xmas options that support the Adafruit Ultimate GPS unit, which I believe they still sell. Other GPS units that output NMEA data at 9600 baud should also work. In particular, the code parses the $GPRMC records to get time data. There is an old Ultimate GPS Tutorial I wrote a while back, which might be helpful.

Have a good tip back north. And as always, good luck and happy hacking!

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