Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

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davclark
 
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Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

I'm referencing the following kit:

https://learn.adafruit.com/kaleidoscope ... -soldering

I verified that the script that comes pre-loaded on the M0 continued to work after upgrade to latest CircuitPython 7.x (at least in terms of driving the internal dotstar, and responding with the red LED to the capacitive touch, both on battery and USB). I had to copy over new libraries for 7.x to make that work.

After soldering everything together, I read 3.3V across the V+ and ground pins on both rings. My first question is that the ring product page claims they might come with WS neopixels, which I think need 5V? The other question about power is whether the Bat pin is appropriate, or if I should be using the 3V pin? (instructions say to use Bat)

I don't have an easy way to check that the D0 is connected properly, but the connections feel mechanically secure.

I will also add that I noted the trinket itself getting uncomfortably hot to the touch on the battery, and then appearing to reboot into safe mode with flashing yellow dotstar (3 blinks, then repeats). Also a bit of the bad electronics smell... And now the USB connection to the computer isn't working.

So, it wasn't working, maybe now it's fried. Any help in debugging would be much appreciated. I've got a handful of other devices lying around including a circuit playground bluefruit and a pygamer, also some other neopixels. So, I'll try to connect different stuff to isolate the problem to the M0 or the rings, but I'm a little worried about frying other devices...

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Franklin97355
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by Franklin97355 »

What size ring do you have and what part number is it? Can you post a picture of the ring connected to the Trinket? Thanks.

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davclark
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

I recalled seeing the 5V indication on the rings, but you can also see that they are 16x WS2812's. So, I wonder if they do indeed need 5V. They came as part of a kit with the Trinket M0, though.

I hope the connections are easy enough for you to see. If needed, I can try again with my nice camera and a better depth of field. (I tried opening up the DOF by using Flash, but you can see it's still pretty tight)

Also, I know the white and grey wires are going outside instead of inside one of the rings. That was an oops, but I figured I'd wait to ensure the kit worked and maybe just leave it if it works in the goggle enclosure.

Note - rings are attached but not inline, but let me know if that's a hassle! I am out of space for this post, so I'll put the trinket on the next one.
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davclark
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

Following up with a pic of the Trinket M0 soldering joints. The only joints that look rough are the surface mounting on the battery connector (the solder bled through a bit on the outside of the USB housing).
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davclark
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

Following up, i have left the LEDs soldered to the Trinket M0, but I've tried finding the try now on my Linux box with tio, and also tried getting into bootloader mode. Neither works.

I'll try desoldering the LEDs and see if the Trinket starts working, but I think the M0 either overheated or otherwise fried something :(

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Smurfcivic
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by Smurfcivic »

I haven’t had any luck using circuit python but they work perfect using arduino. I’ll have to edit files to post pic tom

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davclark
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

The board is completely nonfunctional. I cannot flash a different bootloader, and based on my reading there is a fundamental incompatibility in voltage supply on the board vs. draw from the rings. At this point I suspect my best case is a replacement. Thank you for the note, though!

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mhorwath67
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by mhorwath67 »

I, too, am having problems.

Bought 2 kits specifically to solder up and give to friends tomorrow night for Halloween. Tried to make things easy for myself.

Alas I cannot get the LED rings to work, and after I updated to CircuitPython 7.3.3 I don't even get the blue light anymore on the center of the board.

Sad-panda-is-me

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davclark
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

Hey, @mhorwath67, I'm curious if you also got the same LED controller. Are they also ws2812? Does your board work at all? Based on my reading and experience we probably shouldn't power the boards on with the WS LEDs soldered on - they may cause overheating and then board frying.

(But I'm not an engineer)

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mhorwath67
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by mhorwath67 »

The LED https://www.adafruit.com/product/1463 from the kit. So yes(ish).

Boards are fine; power up, do what I expect, I just cannot get the LEDs to do their thing (light up with battery).

So, desoldered the Trinket and put a PI Pico in place and wham!, all working as expected.

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dastels
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by dastels »

I'll address some of the questions:
After soldering everything together, I read 3.3V across the V+ and ground pins on both rings. My first question is that the ring product page claims they might come with WS neopixels, which I think need 5V? The other question about power is whether the Bat pin is appropriate, or if I should be using the 3V pin? (instructions say to use Bat)
NeoPixels work find with 3ish volts, although not as brightly as with 5v. You should use the bat pin (direct from the battery) since the current available via the 3.3v pin is limited by the 3.3v regulator and NeoPixels are hungry for current.
Based on my reading and experience we probably shouldn't power the boards on with the WS LEDs soldered on - they may cause overheating and then board frying.
Not true.
Following up with a pic of the Trinket M0 soldering joints.
Honestly, none of it looks great.
I noted the trinket itself getting uncomfortably hot to the touch on the battery
On battery, but it was fine powered by USB?

Overheating tends to be caused by a short resulting in too much current flowing through something and hence generating heat. The typical result is a burned out chip.

What battery? Where was it from? If it wasn't from Adafruit, the connector might have the wrong polarity.

Dave

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davclark
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

Thank you for your response @dastels.

To clarify about the battery and heat: It was the battery shipped as part of the kit I mentioned in the title, Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0, but that's the title used on the "learn" page. To be super-clear, I used only parts that were shipped with this kit, including the battery:

https://www.adafruit.com/product/2221

The only exceptions being solder and tools.

Before I attached the leads for the neopixel rings, I soldered on the JST battery connection to the trinket, and was able to program the Trinket via USB. I updated to the latest stable circuitpython (I think 7.3.3) and modified the OEM script that shows off the trinket's features - I recall this quite clearly as my wife is a digital artist and I was excited for the possibilities the Trinket might open up for her. There was an AHA! moment regarding how easy capacitive touch would be with the trinket. I was able to run the Trinket via USB and via battery at this point. I *think* this is inconsistent with there being a short for the surface-mount battery terminal? As I mentioned, some of the solder on the base of the battery terminal is a bit messy, but all that touches is the micro-usb housing - and I believe all of that is just structural, right? The actual surface mount leads from the battery connector are clearly not shorted on visual inspection.

After soldering on the neopixel rings, I *think* I experienced heating no matter whether the Trinket was plugged in to USB or not, but I don't think I disconnected the battery to test usb-only. That said, just now I plugged the whole kit in to USB without the battery, and it started heating and flashing yellow still on the status led. I get the same behavior on just the battery.

The three leads that were added in the neopixel step are easy to inspect visually, and there is no visible short from the SDA, Gnd or Bat pins. Given that the Bat pin should've been fine to deliver the needed voltage to the WS2812-controlled rings, and the 3.3v logic from SDA / pin 0 should've been fine, I have no clear hypothesis. I have left the kit assembled as it was to facilitate a search for shorts or otherwise diagnose what went wrong, but if you don't have any other suggestions, I will proceed to remove the rings from the Trinket and see if the Trinket is fried or not.

Regarding your point that the Bat pin should be fine - I see now that the printing indicates the Bat terminal is 4-6V, which I hadn't seen before. This is inconsistent with the 3.3 volts I was seeing as the difference between power and ground on both neopixel rings. Is that consistent with a short somewhere?

I guess it's worth calling out that someone else chimed in on this thread claiming that they couldn't get the kit working on the trinket, but it worked on an rpi 2040 feather.

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dastels
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by dastels »

OK, it sounds like the battery connection is fine.

Recheck the rings' connections. It sounds like you started having the heating issue after connecting them.

The BAT pin is directly connected to the battery so it will be at whatever voltage the battery is supplying. For a LiPo that'll typically between 3.0v and 4.2v depending how charged it is, but generally around 3.7v.

It would be interesting to see what gets output to the REPL if you get the Trinket connecting to your computer again. I'm not sure when the CircuitPython support was added for this project, but the TrinketM0 (and the SAMD21 MCU in general) isn't as capable of a CircuitPython platform as it once was... as the runtime and libraries continue to evolve and grow.

As for debugging, removing the rings and seeing the state of the Trinket would be interesting.

Dave

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davclark
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

Thank you for the feedback, Dave. I'll be occupied for the long weekend, but hopefully get a chance to mess with this on Monday evening. Have a great break yourself!

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davclark
 
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Re: Neopixel rings not turning on in the Kaleidescope Eyes goggle kit w/ Trinket M0

Post by davclark »

So the holidays are turning out to be less forgiving than hoped, so it's taken a while and I doubt I'll be able to put in all the effort to debug properly.

What I know now:

After desoldering the rings and the surface-mount JST connector, the device still boots, then left alone ends up flashing 3 times yellow for a bit, then stalling out and being hot. I don't get a filesystem or TTY (on Ubuntu 20.04). I DO get a tty and filesystem if I plug in my PyGamer using the same cable. I am pretty sure I'm executing the safe boot mode (click reset while yellow) properly, but that also doesn't give me a tty or mount option. The approach to get trinketboot appears about the same, but that double-click reset also doesn't get me anything visible from Linux.

So, I'm pretty sure the trinket is toast. I'll try the LEDs on something else eventually, but at this point it's unclear if me and the other poster both screwed up or if maybe there's some issue connecting the rings to the trinket M0. I also realize I'm not going to get much out of tracing this to the bottom, so at this point, I'll just plan to trash the trinket, and put the rings in a box for now. It's a bit of a bad taste in my mouth but in general, I'm still appreciative of the work you're doing in the world, so I'm sure I'll still buy stuff here.

Thanks, Dave, for engaging. Please don't bother about this anymore, as I don't have more time to sink into this.

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